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Wednesday, December 8, 1999

The WTO conference in Seattle last week generated hundreds of headlines and images of protesters demonstrating in the streets, and trade leaders ultimately remained at an impasse on issues including agriculture, labor rights and illegally priced imports.

Rep. Sherrod Brown (D-Ohio) was at the meeting, both as a participant and a protester of sorts. An opponent of both NAFTA and GATT, the four-term congressman from northeast Ohio has long opposed China's membership in the WTO. Brown talked about his thoughts on trade and his experiences last week in Seattle on "Free Media" on Wednesday, Dec. 8. The transcript follows:

Free Media: Good afternoon, Rep. Brown, and welcome. Tell us a bit about what you were doing in Seattle
last week during the WTO conference. What were your impressions of the meeting?

Rep. Sherrod Brown: I had the opportunity to see the WTO from the inside -- with trade ministers and US government trade officials -- and from the outside, where I marched with the 40,000 mostly middle aged men and women who belonged to trade unions and environmental groups and food safety organizations.

Washington D.C.: What impression do you think the protests in Seattle had on businesses here in the U.S. regarding global trade?

Rep. Sherrod Brown: I think that US business all over the country -- and US government officials who attended the WTO -- were amazed by the depth of passion and breadth of support for labor and environmental standards that they saw on the streets. Few reporters and other observers predicted the strength of support for these standards, not just from the 40,000 or so peaceful protestors, but also from around the country.

I think American business realizes that they have a huge task in convincing the American people -- and the US Congress -- that free trade without environmental and labor standards is the right way to go.

New York, N.Y.: While I admire people's willingness to go out and fight for something they believe in and make a point, I have to say that the people in turtle costumes, in my opinion, did themselves a disservice. Like the Greenpeace guys who scale buildings. It's great to make a point in a dramatic way, but don't you think people see those pictures and think they must be kooks? Isn't that undercutting the likelihood that people will take them and their message seriously?

Rep. Sherrod Brown: Interestingly, the people in the turtle suits and Teamsters from Portland walked side-by-side in some of the marches.

More dramatically, and ironically, the violent protestors -- a very small minority, to be sure -- brought more attention to the causes that the 40,000 believed in than they ever would have gotten by themselves. That is a sad commentary on our media, on our political system, and on our society.

But nonetheless, the media did a good job in differentiating the difference between the small number who committed criminal acts of violence and the 40,000 peaceful -- and passionate -- protestors who were championing the right causes of labor and environmental standards. Since returning home to Ohio, I believe that the public really did get the message -- that there was violence and that was deplorable, but that there is something dreadfully wrong with the WTO and how it operates.

Free Media: You are a strong opponent of both NAFTA and GATT. What do you think the United States' position should be on trade worldwide? What role do you see for the U.S. in the WTO?

Rep. Sherrod Brown: The US is in a uniquely interesting and crucial time. We have an opportunity, because of our wealth and size, to promote the values that we hold dear. The US and especially US corporations have never been reluctant to have their way around the world.

Since the end of World War II, successive Administrations have pressured other countries to accept our ideas on intelledctual property rights, the deregulation of financial markets, and the privatization of state-run services.

Why should we not try to sell and promote around the world our whole econlomic package including labor, the environment, and human rights. We are so -- justifiably -- proud of our success at exporting our products around the world. Let's work with equal pride in exporting our domocratic values.

If we protect intellectual property, patents, and Hollywood movies around the world, why can't we protect labor rights, the environment, and food safety?

We have great wealth and the most desirable, lucrative market in the world. We can use it to improve standards around the world.

DeLand, Fla.: How productive do you feel the WTO meeting was? Do you believe that the U.S. is in a better position to advocate for American interests than it was prior to the Seattle event?

Rep. Sherrod Brown: The WTO meeting was productive in the sense that it raised the issues of trade in the American consciousness. Before Seattle, few knew what the WTO was. Today, many, many more Americans have some view that the WTO is a group of generally faceless, unknown trade and finance ministers who are writing the rules -- without public input -- of the global economy. And I think most Americans don't much like that.

The failure of the WTO Seattle Round to launch trade talks will help the American people focus on this very important issue. That, with perhaps some irony, is its success.

Wadsworth, Ohio: Many foreign officials argue that the WTO, and other such entities, are American instruments used to spread American ideologies and establish a type of institutional dominance over World politics. Your thoughts?

Rep. Sherrod Brown: I have to answer the question from Wadsworth, Ohio, home (nearby) of northern Ohio's first veterans' cemetery (which will open early next year). I would hope that a little commercial for a very livable community in my district would be in order.

I don't think that the WTO is (or was) an instrument for American hegemony or American ideological dominance. The WTO has, however, served almost exclusively corporate interests in large part because it is a secretive organization whose decisions are made in private by trade lawyers without their having to disclose much of anything.

For example, every decision made by the WTO on environment, public health, and safety laws has been decided against the democratically attained health and safety law. Every single one. The corporate influence on WTO is simply much too great.

Chicago, Ill.: Do you think the riots could have been prevented? If so, how?

Rep. Sherrod Brown: could have been prevented. The Seattle police and the city adminstration were warned that the number of demonstrators would exceed the estimates originally thought. I'm not sure that they were prepared for that number of people, and the hangers-on that crowds of that size typically draw.

Toledo, Ohio: Regarding those "anarchists" who got violent in Seattle...on one hand violence should never be condoned and they overshadowed law-abiding protesters; but on the other, I know that I only paid attention because of all the hubub they caused and where before I didn't even think about the WTO, I now am skeptical about it. What do you make of the net result of all the commotion in Seattle?

Rep. Sherrod Brown: Your point is exactly right. The attention paid to Seattle -- and that is, as I said earlier, a sad commentary on all of us perhaps -- was in direct proportion to the violence in the streets.


The violence may have gotten the public's attention. But the net result was that the public paid attention to the peaceful demonstrators and what all of us said. The delegates inside also heard the peaceful demonstrators and their calls for labor and environmental standards loud and clear.

Washington, D.C.: In many ways, organized labor has really lost a foothold in politics in this country -- they supported President Clinton and ended up with NAFTA. Yet they're still supporting him, more often than not. What role do you think organized labor can play in terms of trade worldwide?

Rep. Sherrod Brown: Organized labor played a key role in the Seattle protests, the peaceful ones, not to take away from the role of other groups, especially environmental and student protestors.

Labor must play the key role around the world; that means that US labor must build coalitions with unions around the world, especially in developing countries. Many developing countries -- especially their elite classes which run their governments -- look with suspicion upon the US labor movement, and believe their interest is only to protect their jobs. That's why a coalition across borders with labor federations in Africa, Latin America, and Asia is essential for American labor.

Buffalo, N.Y.: I am a hard-nosed liberal Democrat. I would love to see the Democratic Party at least win back the House in the next elections. How good of a chance do you think we have?

Rep. Sherrod Brown: Almost everyone in Washington these days -- in both parties, and independents too -- believe that the Democrats will regain the majority in the House of Representatives. They look at GOP retirements (20+ while only about 10 Dem retirements), fundraising successes, candidate recruitment, and the like.

But more importantly, people all over the country are hearing the Democrats' message -- the Patient Bill of Rights, prescription drug coverage for Medicare beneficiaries, 100,000 new teachers and other education programs. It's pretty clear that the country -- from my conversations in my district in Ohio and from polls I've seen -- is much more sympathetic to what the Democrats are saying.

Washington, D.C.: How did President Clinton's address go over with the other delegations?

Rep. Sherrod Brown: Many were not thrilled with the President's much-delayed call for labor standards. As the leaders in the USA oppose labor standards (especially large businesses), the leaders in other countries (most of whom are strongly supported by the pro-big business factions in their own countries) also oppose them.

President Clinton has never been very supportive of labor standards in trade agreements. I discussed this in a book I recently wrote called Congress from the Inside. It documents the fight over NAFTA in my first term (and the president's first term) in 1993. The president has finally moved in the direction of including labor standards in trade agreements, as he promised this year in his State of the Union address.

Free Media: What's the likelihood that the WTO meeting next year in Switzerland will be an open proceeding? It's a chief complaint about the WTO that it meets behind closed doors.

Rep. Sherrod Brown: Good question. Some cynics have said that the next WTO trade talks -- attempting to launch a new round -- will take place at a place like Indonesia or Singapore, where the police are not quite so "gentle."

But you are right. The WTO meetings themselves -- when the panels convene to decide trade disagreements or challenges -- must be open to the public and must be receptive to outside NGO petitions. As I said earlier, this closed, secretive process has resulted in the striking down of every single democratically attained environmental and health law.

Kensington, Md.: I understand you have a bill to establish compulsory licensing of prescription drugs in this country. Can you explain why this measure will help more people afford the exploding cost of prescription drugs?

Rep. Sherrod Brown: The price of prescription drugs is by and large determined by the drug companies in a monopolistic price-setting structure; in short, the drug companies charge what they want when there is no generic alternative.

My bill will allow a generic company to come in and compete with the monopolistically priced drug, paying a royalty to the patent holder. Prices assuredly would come down.

Drug companies argue that they would have to stop research, or at least curtail it dramatically, if this bill passes. Understand, though, that taxpayers pay for literally hald the cost of research and development for new prescription drugs in this country. Yet we are rewarded by these same drug companies with the highest prices in the world -- higher than the prices people pay in Japan, France, Germany, England, or anywhere else.

Cleveland, Ohio: If the Democratic Party takes control of Congress during the next election, you will personally gain a significant amount of power. What will your agenda include?

Rep. Sherrod Brown: If the Democrats regain the majority, I would become the chairman of the Commerce Committee's Health and Environment Subcommittee, which writes all health care and environmental legislation in the House.

The first thing we would do is move on the prescription drug issue. The second thing would be the Medicare buy-in proposal, which would allow people between 55 and 64 years old to voluntarily buy into Medicare.

And there will be more.

Rep. Sherrod Brown: Thank you for allowing me to participate. The questions were excellent. I wish I could type faster.

Free Media: That was our last question today for Rep. Sherrod Brown (D-Ohio). Thanks to Rep. Brown, and to everyone who joined us today.

Tune in Friday at 11 a.m. EST for "Holding Court," when Post Supreme Court reporter Joan Biskupic will talk about this week's action in the court, including the justices' decision to revisit the landmark 1966 Miranda decision.

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