Elyse Luray and Gwen Wright Appraiser and Professor Tuesday, July 29, 2003; Noon ET
"History Detectives" is a 10-part PBS series that explores the true stories behind historic sites, artifacts and tall tales told in cities across the country. This segment explores personal histories of a woman finding her family connection to abolitionist John Brown through his letters, the history of an authentic Japanese House in California and a second generation Chinese American finding more about her great grandfather through poems about Angel Island. Elyse Luray and Gwen Wright were online Tuesday, July 22 at noon ET, to discuss the series. Luray is an auctioneer, independent appraiser and an expert in art history. Wright is a professor of architecture at Columbia University. The next episode of "History Detectives" airs on PBS Monday July 28, 2003 at 8:00 p.m. ET. (check local listings). Each week, detectives track down the best in the fields of forensics, historical research, architecture and archaeology, to examine the truth about the historical records of the homes, towns and personal possessions of everyday Americans. The transcript follows. Editor's Note: washingtonpost.com moderators retain editorial control over Live Online discussions and choose the most relevant questions for guests and hosts; guests and hosts can decline to answer questions.
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Elyse Luray and Gwen Wright: Good afternoon, Thank you for watching the History Detectives. Please let us know how we can help you!
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Washington, D.C.: Hello. Now that you've filmed several episodes of History Detectives how are you finding the experience?
Elyse Luray and Gwen Wright: I love every investigation. I am enjoy learning about other people's history and more importanly helping others. The people have been great and so interesting to meet. I love traveling all over the country to investigate. I have also enjoyed visiting Historical Societies and Museums.
elyse
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Atlanta, Ga.: What is it like when you find the clue that opens the whole mystery up?
Elyse Luray and Gwen Wright: AMAZING! Its so exciting! You just want to tell the whole world!
elyse
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Somewhere, USA: On the show researching the Gilbert Stuart, the detectives spoke to two experts. One was Thomas Hoving. Would you tell me the name of the other gentleman and how to reach him?
Elyse Luray and Gwen Wright: I loved that episode. We spoke to an art historian, David Meschutt, located in West Point, NY and the forger, John Myatt, based in London.
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Washington, D.C.: In the segment on the Japanese house, I didn't get if the house was recreated from the World Fair or was the remainder part of the World Fair.
Elyse Luray and Gwen Wright: Thanks for your interest. The "tea room" (as they call it) of the Sakais' house was originally the "Silk Room" of the Japanese pavilion at the 1939 World's Fair in San Francisco. At the end of the Fair Mrs. Sakai's father bought and brought home the disassembled wood and shoji parts of this room and then hired two Japanese-American caprenter- builders from San Jose to build the rest of their house around this room (which is, even now, the right section of the house as one enters, the room where we did all the interior filming. It is truly beautiful craftsmanship.
Gwen Wright
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Owings Mill, Md.: How do you pick your stories? Are you presently taking idea submissions or have you completed the season? What would you most like to investigate and why?
Elyse Luray and Gwen Wright: We picked the stories with the best stories. We also look closely at subject matter, history and our ability to help the person. We are still taking submissions for new stories and have enjoyed seeing the e-mails come in.
I enjoy investigating everything, but I particularly love stories from the Wild West.
By the way, I am sure you know, you are from my home town.
Elyse
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washingtonpost.com : You can submit your mystery ideas to the History Detectives web site.
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Bethesda, Md.: It's very neat to see you all work together within your various expertise. Has there ever been a time where you all disagree on how to go about solving a mystery or disagree on what you have found? How has your working relationship been with each other?
Elyse Luray and Gwen Wright: Of course there are moments when we all disagree but we usually resolve our differences with facts. Ninety Five percent of the time we are all on the same page. Each "detective" has different strengths and we use each others knowledge to help the investigation. I personally enjoy working with everyone!
Elyse
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Takoma Park, Md.:
I've watched all your shows. They are GREAT!
Could you tell us why the young Chinese woman didn't do more initial leg work talking to her relatives about her grandfather and great-grandfather?
Elyse Luray and Gwen Wright: We were in fact surprised by the range of such knowledge among the generation of her father, though few of them had ever talked about it. It is true of many such families, and to some extent a sign of respect: there was a great deal of caution about talking about the past in these families, since the elders (who had had such difficulties immigrating) didn't want to burden their children and grandchildren with these bad memories, fearing this would hold them back from succeeding in American society. Unfortunately, the final cut of the segment didn't fully explain the concept of the "paper son." To gain entry during the years a Chinese immigrant had to prove, through grueling interrogations about family history, that he was descended from a resident of the United States. Many would-be immigrants would assume the identity of someone who did have a relative; in this case, Kathleen's grandfather claimed to be his cousin, whose father had indeed come to the US.
Thanks for your interest.
Gwen Wright
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Fredericksburg, Va.: I LOVE the show!!!! Will there be another season?
Elyse Luray and Gwen Wright: Hopefully! thanks for your comments!
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Vienna, Va.: Is there anything being done to preserve the Chinese poems on the walls of Angel Island? I didn't catch that in the episode.
Elyse Luray and Gwen Wright: Dear Vienna, Virginia,
Yes, since the poems are now being researched by a group of Chinese-American scholars, Angel Island is now being preserved as a museum of this experience. There is even a book with photographs and poems, called "Angel Island." It's an important segment of our collective history, one that explains the many contradictory attitudes about and experiences of immigration and "race," past and present, in this country.
Thanks for watching.
Gwendolyn Wright
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Washington, D.C.:
I'm fascinated by your historical sleuthing.
Is the detective work you do something an amateur can also do (time and money and lack of a camera crew notwithstanding)? Do you have access to materials and sources that the general public does not?
Elyse Luray and Gwen Wright: Anyone can be a sleuth. Historical Societies are open to the public. I think you will be surprised to see how excited and willing Historians are to talk about history. Auction Houses are another great source. Their appraisals are usually free (done by appointment or photograph.) If you go to our website at historydetectives@pbs.org, you will see tons of information on how to do research.
Good luck and most importantly, have fun!
Elyse
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Durand, Mich. :
I was wondering if you could give me some ideas as to where to look for ancestors of Native American heritage. I have one in a census, which is how we discovered her to be Native, however we can't find anything beyond that. Another, according to family stories is Native, however we can't find anything on her except that she was married to my g. grandfather. I hope you have some ideas! Thanks!
~Mindy
Elyse Luray and Gwen Wright: Do you know what reservation she was born on? Do you have any more information? I would start by trying to track down her roots (ask relatives, old friends, look at old photos, etc) Where did they get married? Was there a reservation near by? If so, I would start there. Good luck!
elyse
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Grand Junction, Colo.:
Who was it that relocated in Grand Junction?
Throughout Colorado there are so many Jappanese-Americans that were located here.
They seem to be all prosperous farmers and businessmen. Nice people!
Elyse Luray and Gwen Wright: Dear Grand Junction,
Indeed, there are many Japanese-Aemricans in Colorado, especially in the eastern section of the state. Facing internment camps in California, those Japanese and Japanese-Americans who had the money often moved quickly to the other side of the "line" drawn through the state of Colorado; it was reasoned that no one could be a useful spy from that far away. This is what happened to Mrs Sakai, her mother and her brothers and sisters in early January of 1942.
So we see ongoing effects of these policies from 60 years ago.
Thanks for your interest in the show.
Gwendolyn Wright
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Ivoryton, Conn.:
formerly somewhere USA-
Thank you for the name of Mr.Meschutt. Would you be interested in doing another show about an unusual Gilbert Stuart, cause I have one
Elyse Luray and Gwen Wright: please submit to pbs.org/obp/historydetectives
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Rockville, Md.: What are the next mystery episodes that both of you will be working on? And are you contracted to do this on your free time or do you do this along with your other work?
Elyse Luray and Gwen Wright: Elyse and I are right now doing a story in Philadelphia that will be part of our last episode for this series, which airs in mid-September. It's about about some French porcelain dishes owned by a Mrs. Powel, one of the great hostesses of the Revolutiony and early Federal era and a political confident of leaders like Lafayette and George Washington.
All of us are juggling this with other jobs -- in my case, being a professor, organizing an exhibition, writing books and articles, advising doctoral students. So there's NO free time -- and often not even much sleep!
Best,
Gwendolyn Wright
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Maryland: How long does it take to film one segment of a mystery? Also, how do you divide the tasks in which you solve a mystery? Is everyone located at the same place or do all of you work for PBS?
Elyse Luray and Gwen Wright: Good question. After a lot of background research, we usually spend 4 days filming each story. Elyse and I are based in New York and New Jersey, respectively. Takufu is in Philadelphia, and Wes lives in Cincinnati. These days we're usually all on the road most of the time! None of us works for PBS; we have other jobs and were contracted to do this series. We divide the stories in terms of our particular fields of expertise and personal interest in a topic or a place.
Thanks for your interest.
Gwendolyn Wright
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Silver Spring Md.: I recently had my grandfather's World War I diary restored by a curator. It's a wonderful keepsake with lots of interesting stories. My question, however, is how can I learn more about his military service? I have a copy of his discharge papers, but I'd like to know more. The problem is I understand his--and many other Army vets--records were destroyed in a 1967 fire at the St. Louis warehouse. Any ideas where I can go from here?
Elyse Luray and Gwen Wright: I would check with the records at historical societies, visit the library of congress and check with the Army. Try and start with the information you have in the diary. Do you know where and with whom he served? Who were his commanders? Hopefully the diary will be filled with information that could lead you to his troops.
good luck!
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Somewhere, USA: Where are Tukufu and Wes -- the other detectives?
Elyse Luray and Gwen Wright: Hi, Right now Wes is on a shoot in Oregon and Tukufu is in Africa, so Elyse and I are sharing this Washington Post interview.
Gwendolyn Wright
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Falls Church, Va: Respectfully, Elyse, I was a bit annoyed that you kept repeating "Unbelievable" during your findings of the torture of slaves that took place by that woman in Maryland. Horrific, chilling, awful, yes, but unbelievable? No. It happened. A lot.
Elyse Luray and Gwen Wright: yes I understand. When you see/read something for the first time it is quite upsetting. I did not mean to offend anyone, it was just my first response. I will never understand how people can become so unhuman. Horrific, chilling and awful are all words to correctly use.
thanks for your response.
Elyse
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Curious Virginia: After watching John Brown's letters, I was wondering if you ever come across something that looked real but turned out fake. How do you make sure that what you are looking at is authentic without pouring so much effort into a mystery only to find that it was false from the beginning?
Elyse Luray and Gwen Wright: Yes, fakes are out there. Unfortuately, you can spend hours, days and months researching something and then it turns out to be fake or the story is just impossible to verify. Finding out that the story if false or the objects is a forgery, is just as important as find out if its real.
Elyse
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Silver Spring, Md.:
Have you had a mystery where someone was looking for a relative and that you found out were still alive? Any happy family reunion type of segment that we can look forward to?
Elyse Luray and Gwen Wright: No, we've never had a story like that. All of our stories are based on an artifact or a building, which often ties into family history -- but this has never produced knowledge about a living relative. In the case of Kathleen's family, however, they all learned more about their father-uncle-grandfather and his father as well (according to the individual person). In addition, the immigration files we gave each of them describe many other family relatioans and even include maps of the village in China where they had lived. This was part of the interrogations undertaken by the US immigration officials, who were trying to find out about real (or purported) family history that would connect a would-be immigrant with a father or grandfather who lived or had lived in the US. (California required this direct family connection for immigration, although Washington, DC, officials were far more open toward Chinese immigrants.)
Thanks for your interest. Our shows do uncover many kinds of family history -- though we also disprove some family or local myths. We also connect these histories with larger issues that affect all of us.
Best,
Gwendolyn Wright
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Fairfax, Va.: Is there a type of mystery or a region that the team would love to investigate but have not received submissions for?
Elyse Luray and Gwen Wright: I personally would love to visit the west, but we have not had many stories from Idaho, Colorado, New Mexico, Montana, Wyoming, etc. There are certainly many topics that could come from these areas. It would be great fun!
Elyse
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Greenville, N.C.: What I would like to know is, what book about a historical figure or event has interested you the most during you life and what about the book did you find most interesting? Either or both hosts' opinion would be welcomed. Also, what is the most interesting case you have ever been on, where you have learned the most?
Elyse Luray and Gwen Wright: First your last question: the show where I learned the most probably was last night's story about the Japanese house. It tied together a specific family's history with the histories of both the US and Japan, and it explores the many kinds of "identity" people feel about themselves and others. It also shows so many responses to architecture, how and why certain styles and structures evolve and how they're understood by various people.
As far as a historical book, I was fascinated, many years ago, by Richard Goldthwaite's book on the houses of Renaissance Florence, which shows how architecture can bring together social history, family history, political and economic history. I ttried to do this myself with "Moralism and the Model Home" about domestic architecture and cultural conflict in Chicago at the turn of the last century!
Thanks for such a good question.
Best,
Gwendolyn Wright
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Elyse Luray and Gwen Wright:
The "Diary of Anne Frank" was the book I found the most interesting. I am always amazed at how this young girl could be so strong, smart, insightful and good natured during such a horrific situation. I have visited the home where she was hidden many times. She has given me inspiration to be a strong person and be happy for the simple things in life.
In nexts weeks episode, I visit San Antonio, and research Mexican Pesos. I have learned about the Mexican Revolution. I am sad to say that I had forgotten most of the facts about the Revolution and enjoyed learning about all the different leaders and rebels.
elyse
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Vienna, Va.: Gwen in your research for the Japanese house, you called a colleague in Japan. Have there been mysteries where any of the detectives had to travel outside of the U.S. to solve a mystery?
Elyse Luray and Gwen Wright: Hello. Interesting question. Thusfar this was the only story in which we had someone do research out of the US. Elyse herself did work in Mexico for the story on the pesos, but we only used the phone and fax machine for Japan! Too bad, I would have loved to go back. Right now we're filming a story based in Philadelphia which also involves talking with a French specialist in 18th-century porcelain.
Thanks for your interest in the show and how we carry out our reearch.
Gwendolyn Wright
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Portland, Ore.: Regarding last night's episode: For a 150-year-old document, the John Brown letter looked in very good shape. No tears or other deterioration. Did you display the original on the show, or was that a copy?
Elyse Luray and Gwen Wright: We use the original documents on the show. However, during research, we may copy the document to take with us to the various places. Yes, last night's document was in excellent condition, but did have wear to the edges, folds and some foxing (browning) to the paper.
elyse
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Elyse Luray and Gwen Wright: Thank you all for your fascinating questions about our research, our stories, and our show. We all feel that questions are the key to good history!
Gwendolyn Wright
Elyse Luray
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washingtonpost.com : That wraps up today's show. Thanks to everyone who joined the discussion.
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