Donald Miller (Courtesy Lafayette College)

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'American Experience:
Chicago'
With Donald L. Miller
Author, Professor of History
Tuesday, Jan. 14, 2003; 1 p.m. ET

The new PBS American Experience program "Chicago: City of the Century" chronicles Chicago's transformation from a remote fur trading post to the quintessential American city of the nineteenth century. Bringing to life Chicago's rich mix of cultures, its immigrants and merchant princes, its political corruption and labor upheavals, City of the Century bears witness to the creation of one of the most dynamic and vibrant cities in the world.

Donald L. Miller, author of "City of the Century: The Epic of Chicago and the Making of America" was online Tuesday, Jan. 14 at 1 p.m. ET, to discuss the history of America's Second City and the PBS program.

Miller is John Henry MacCracken Professor of History at Lafayette College in Easton, Pa. In addition to "Chicago: City of the Century," Miller has participated in the making of several other documentaries for American Experience, including "Ulysses S. Grant," "Abraham and Mary Lincoln: A House Divided," and "America 1900," which won the George Foster Peabody Award.

Miller is host of the PBS series "A Biography of America" and author of five other books, which have been nominated for almost every major national literary prize.

The transcript follows.

Editor's Note: Washingtonpost.com moderators retain editorial control over Live Online discussions and choose the most relevant questions for guests and hosts; guests and hosts can decline to answer questions.

Crozet, Va.: I loved the first episode of the series last night. The program didn't talk at length about the effect of the Civil War on the city. We know, for example, that New York City had draft riots during the war, fueled by ethnic and racial tensions among other things. What was the situation in Chicago at the time?

Donald L. Miller: Chicago was at the very center of Ulysses Grant's campaign to seize the Mississippi. In addition, many escaped slaves came into Illinois and were hidden in Chicago by abolishonists like Mary Livermore. There was also a lot of southern secessionist sentiment in the city so, Chicago became a battleground between Unionists and Secessionists, although the violence never reached the level of New York's.

Chicago, Ill.: What lessons did our city's "founding fathers" learn from and do better as the city developed, and which mistakes do you think they repeated? Which of those lessons learned or "history-repeats-itself" mistakes are still evident in the way the city is today?

Donald L. Miller: They learned that uncontrolled capitalism can cause enormous social problems, such as labor violence, environmental pollution, rampaging disease, etc. By the end of the century, most of the city's capitalists, while still firmly committed to capitalist growth, cautioned that such growth must be tamed and controlled if Chicago was to be a place to live in, not just to make money in. I think this is a lesson that was firmly established in the minds and practices of 20th Century Chicago leaders.

I think the city is just recently beginning to come to grips with one of its greatest human errors: housing segregation. I'm encouraged, however, by the Daly administration's efforts on behalf of desegregation.

Arlington, Va.: What inspired you to study the city of Chicago? What do you find to be the most interesting characteristics of this city -- then and now? Is there another city like it today? If so, which?

Donald L. Miller: I originally planned to write a novel about fifteenth century Florence. While writing that novel I took a trip to Chicago and walked out onto the Michigan Avenue Bridge. I read the plaque on the bridge commemorating the voyage of discovery of Joliet and Marquette in 1673. I could almost see in my mind's eye those French explorers paddling in the river underneath me. Then my eyes went up and I took in the tremendous wall of skyscrapers along the banks of the Chicago River. I thought to myself, in the big picture there was not a lot of time betwen Chicago's discovery and the building of the first skyscrapers. I thought to myself, this would be a wonderful story to tell, tracing the history of the city from 1673 to the construction of a skyscraper downtown in the 1880s and 90's. I left Chicago convinced that this is the story, an American story, I really wanted to tell.

Its ability to reinvent itself. Its toughness. Its unconquerable optimism. And, its sense of experimentation, i.e., its refusal to be bound by old traditions.

Berlin, today, reminds me very much of Chicago in the 1890's. It's recovering from two major disasters: World War II and a communist occupation and is rebuilding itself with that Chicago spirit of optimism and experimentalism. It has some of the freshest, most original architecture in the world and it's a city with a sense of destiny.

Washington, D.C.: How much of your book was the American Experience special able to delve into?

Donald L. Miller: The film was based solidly on the book. Naturally, large parts of the book could not be incorporated into a film, even one of 4 1/2 hours. I would've liked, for example, to have Gurdon Hubbard a central part of the film's narrative as he is a central part of the book's narrative. Hubbard's life, from his arrival in Chicago at age 16 in 1818, until his death in 1886 is the epic of Chicago. The reason we couldnt include Hubbard more centrally in the film is because there are only two or three existing photographs of the man and a film producer builds his story around the visual materials available.

Washington, D.C.: Do you live in Chicago?

Donald L. Miller: No, I don't and I visited the city on occasionally before beginning the book. After that, I was a constant intruder.

Milwaukee, Wisc.: Why do you think Chicago became THE big midwestern city and not Milwaukee? Just 100 miles or so north, it shares similar geography, water access, and natural resources. (Once those train tracks were laid down, it makes sense that Chicago had to make it work, but up until then, could it just have easily been in Milwaukee?)

Donald L. Miller: It could've been in Milwaukee. One reason it wasn't is that New York speculators with large fortunes to invest in canals and railroads, set their sites on Chicago as an investment opportunity because the state of Illinois established Chicago in 1830 as the terminus of the Illinois and Michigan Canal. Also, Chicago was on a direct line from New York geographically. It sat at the bottom of Lake Michigan and railroads from the east could more easily reach it, then point north like Milwaukee and Green Bay. Once the canal was built, New York had a stake in Chicago and investors and settlers poured in from the East.

Hahira, Ga.: I am currently reading the classic, Studs Lonigan by James T. Farrell, about a young Irish man growing up in Chicago in the 1920's. Last night's show dealt with discrimination against the Irish; however, in this book, the Irish discriminate against Jews and blacks. Studs and his gang are particularly concerned with Jews and blacks moving into their neighborhood.

Is this racial strife still evident in Chicago today?

Donald L. Miller: The story that Farrell told is true in all its essentials. Once the Irish rose on the social scale, they began to practice discrimination against new arrivals in the city, particularly Jews, Italians and blacks. Some of the worst racial animosity that Martin Luther King experienced was, he said, in Chicago. And much of it emanated from older Irish neighborhoods. I think, however, that tensions between blacks and the Irish in Chicago have considerably diminished, although racism and ethnocentrism remain, unfortunately, part of the fabric of this and every other large American city.

Harrisburg, Pa.: What are your impressions of the late Mayor Richard Daley? Did he help integrate new generations into the city power structure, or did he permit too much corruption to occur to have been an effectitve leader for Chicago? How does his time as mayor change Chicago?

Donald L. Miller: At the time Daley took office, Chicago was in the doldrums. He engineered a massive rebuilding and revitalization effort and helped to turn Chicago once again into a world-class city. His most unfortunate legacy was not corruption, although that did occur in his administration. It was his encouragement of racial segregation in housing.

Leesburg, Va.: For being the third largest city in the U.S., you rarely hear about Chicago in the national news. Any idea why? Does it just lack the clout and influence of L.A. and New York?

Donald L. Miller: In a media-centered world, L.A. and New York, naturally, overshadow Chicago. This, unfortunately, undervalues Chicago's international importance. In my mind it remains one of the most innovative and livable cities -- not just in the U.S. but in the world. To many people on the east and west coasts, Chicago and the midwest, are merely flyover territories. These people miss what many European tourists consider this country's most American city and the city Frank Lloyd Wright called the most beautiful in the country.

Herndon, Va.: You've mentioned segregated housing a couple of times. I remember as a kid being forbidden to go near Cabrini Green because of the racial tensions and crime in the area. What ever happened to that complex - is it still public housing?

Donald L. Miller: It's being torn down and now, ironically, it's one of the hottest areas in the city's nightlife.

Arlington, Va.: I grew up in Wheaton, Illinois, a far-western suburb of Chicago. I remember we were taught that Wheaton was an essential stop on the underground railroad. Is there any truth to this?

Donald L. Miller: Yes. As I mentioned, there was an active colony of abolishionists in Illinois including Allan Pinkerton, the founder of the Pinkerton Detective Service that defended Lincoln.

Somerville, Maine: As Chicago grew and became increasingly urbanized in the 19th century, what happened to relations between Chicagoans and Native Americans?

Donald L. Miller: When Chicago was established as a town in the early 1830's, the Native American tribes of the region were "removed" from Illinois and forced to settle west of the Mississippi. Chicago was originally a trading center populated by French Canadians and their Indian allies. It was a multi-ethnic community with a large amount of racial toleration. The arrival of Yankee capitalists from the East changed the situation dramatically and permanently. Chicago was gridded. A town government was established. And white settlers moved in in increasingly great numbers once the so-called Indian "menace" was removed. From that time forward Chicago existed as if the Native Americans had never been part of its history.

Donald L. Miller: For more information on why I wrote about Chicago and why I think Chicago was the most important city of the nineteenth century, I refer readers to the March issue of "American Heritage" magazine, where Frederick Allan interviews me.

Union Grove, Wisc.: Is there any truth to the argument I've heard that the Peshtigo (Wisc.) Fire was actually a more devastating event than the Chicago Fire, but since they happened at the same time and Chicago is/was more familiar, it is most well-known?

Donald L. Miller: Yes. I describe the Peshtigo Fire in my book, "City of the Century." One of my main characters, William Ogden, has a lumber empire in the Peshtigo area and it was destroyed along with his enormous Chicago holdings in these two fires. Over 1100 persons were killed in and around Peshtigo, a village of 2000/that is over three times as many as were killed in Chicago.

Waldorf, Md. Tremendously enjoyed last night's episode. How much of tonight's will be devoted to the 1893 World's Columbian Exposition? (I'm something of a specialized historian of it, myself.)

Graet job!

Donald L. Miller: Very little. Part three deals directly with the Exposition.

New Jersey: Why did you have to dedicate so much time to the slaughtering of the swine? I'm hearing those yips in my sleep.

Donald L. Miller: This is the industry that established Chicago as a worldwide center of industrial change. The way the animals were slaughtered was a precursor of modern assembly line production, which changed the world forever. The animals were the unfortunate victims and we tried to portray them as such. The blood of the yards was an integral part of the Chicago story however unseemly the killing process. It's something we felt we couldn't and shouldn't avoid, however distasteful. We wanted to tell the story of Chicago was it was -- not as people would like to believe it was.

Streamwood, Ill.: Chicago is always thought to have a strong Catholic church...did it play any role in the societal and labor movements and changes that happened in Chicago?

Donald L. Miller: Yes, as you'll see in episodes two and three. Catholic immigrants built their communities around their churches, established parochial schools, taught their children to speak English and gave them basic survival skills. The story of Chicago's neighborhoods is in large part the story of these religious-centered ethnic communities. In our film, we show not only how people came to America, but more importantly, how they made it in America. And the religiously-centered ethnic communities are an integral part of this great American story.

Washington, D.C.: From the web site materials, there is a clear impression that Chicago was at times a very dirty city. Has it changed? Is there any attention to "greening" the city?

Donald L. Miller: Chicago has changed immensely. From being one of the filthiest cities in America it has gone to being one of the cleanest. The Chicago River is being cleaned up and fresh, edible fish are being caught in the river. Mayor Daley has undertaken a massive beautification project in Chicago, centered largely on the center city. Chicago today has broad, clean streets lined with plantings, decorative lights and magnificently clean streamlined buildings.

Chicago has also pioneered new ways of powering and heating its buildings using wind power as shown in a recent article in Time magazine. And Mayor Daley is often referred to as the "Green" mayor and that doesn't refer to his Irish heritage.

Donald L. Miller: If readers want to learn more about Chicago, there's an excellent Web site: www.pbs.org and I can refer you to my book, "City of the Century" which is a companion volume to the TV series. It's available at all books stores and from PBS as advertised in the televison credits for the series.

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