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Bookclub: "The Land"
Presented by Elizabeth Ward
Book World Children's Book Columnist
Thursday, Aug. 29, 2002; Noon EDT
Welcome to the online meeting of The Washington Post Book Club, a monthly program presented by the editors and writers of Washington Post Book World.
This month Post columnist Elizabeth Ward will be leading a discussion on this month's selection, Mildred D. Taylor's "The Land." Read this month's review of "The Land."
Ward is the Book World's children's book columnist. Her column, "For Young Readers," appears two Sundays a month.
The transcript follows.
Editor's Note: Washingtonpost.com moderators retain editorial control over Live Online discussions and choose the most relevant questions for guests and hosts; guests and hosts can decline to answer questions.
Elizabeth Ward: Hello, and welcome to today's discussion of "The Land," by Mildred Taylor. I'd love to hear from fans of all ages. The latest in Taylor's long saga of the Logan family, "the Land" is the earliest in time--and, I think, among the best. Maybe some of you, like me, were initially disappointed that we wouldn't be carrying on with the story of Cassie Logan after we left her at the end of "The Road to Memphis" on the verge of adulthood. (I hear that sequel's comning, though, maybe in 2004.) Instead, we were to be taken back in time to the Reconstruction years and the story of Cassie's grandfather, the benevolent ghost who presides over her childhood years on the piece of Mississippi land he'd so painfully acquired. But what a story it turned out to be, and what a vivid presence that ghost took on. Now let's hear what everyone else thinks.
Washington, D.C.:
How would you compare Mildred Taylor's work to more edgier writers for the same age group, ie. Roald Dahl or Gary Paulsen? Does she address any of the same dark impulses they do?
Elizabeth Ward: Dahl and Paulsen? I wouldn't compare them to Mildred Taylor at all. Dahl's stories for young adults (as opposed to his delightful classics for younger readers) specialize in a slick and twisted sort of wit that is miles removed from the dignity that marks all Taylor's books. Not that her heroes and heroins are stodgy; they can be quick-tempered, and equally quick-witted. But they are...honorable. Not a word I associate with the characters in a collection like Dahl's "The Umbrella Man." Paulsen is different again. I think of him more as a survival writer, interested in human endurance. I suppose Taylor is, too, but her characters are pitted against social rather than natural obstacles. Paulsen did write a couple of YA books set in the slavery era, I think ("Nightjohn"? something like that), but I haven't read them. I would guess that they dwell more graphically on physical brutality than Taylor's books do. He is fascinated by it, just as Dahl seems fascinated by human viciousness. Taylor isn't. She's fascinated by what inspires people to withstand it.
Lenexa, Kan.:
Ms. Ward,
I was really moved (and enjoyed the humor) of "The Land" and "Roll of Thunder..." (read the prequel first). Old Taylor fans, of course, would have read it last--should have been fun (like Faulkner fleshing out...).
"The Land" is such a natural flowing narrative--maybe in part because it is so based in fact. I esp. liked Paul's "pride"--coupled with his ardor--causing him to nearly work himself to death for the forty acres. (It reminded me of another childhood favorite: the Red Fern-boy who dreamed, worked, and saved for his prided coon dogs.)
Was Paul-Edward always likable? He had wonderful parents. The times he was "unlikable" seem explainable within the times and ethos that he lived. His unfair treatment of Wade Jamison was surely a generational quirk of the same. Your comments? Thanks.
Elizabeth Ward: I'm glad you zeroed in on the humor. It's one of Taylor's great strengths, I think. You come expecting unbearable grimness, which you do get as well, but you also get such wonderfully feisty, funny exchanges, you find yourself laughing as much as wincing. As for Paul-Edward's "unlikeableness," I found I liked him better on a second reading, oddly enough. The first time round, I was struck by his smugness, or what I took for smugness. On a second reading, I appreciated better the fact that he was, after all, as smart as a whip and had pretty good reason to be cocky.
Silver Spring, Md.:
I'm not familiar with the book but what age does the book write for?
Elizabeth Ward: That's a good question, actually. I would say it's for sharp teenagers, say 12 or 13 on up. The reason I say sharp is because there's actually a lot of adult-level material in "The Land": not violence or sex, but quite complex matters of work and business. It's one of the things I like about the book: you get amazingly detailed accounts of everything from farming, carpentering (and the apprentice system), 19th-century lumber and turpentine camps and horse-rearing and -racing to land contracts and dealings and "hagglin' " of all kinds.
Bethesda, Md.:
Ms. Ward,
Do you have children? What is their response to this book? Is your sense that children are as responsive to thoughtful books (not fantasy, necessarily) in this day and age?
Elizabeth Ward: Hi. I have three children, two boys now in college and a 17-year-old daughter who's about to start her senior year in high school. She was the one of the three who really loved the trilogy when she was younger. Naturally, she read "The Land" when it came out last year and, if I recall correctly, decided it was "as good as 'Roll of Thunder.' " High praise indeed. Your other question is interesting. I think it depends on the kid, not the day and age. My older son, for example, spent his teenage years immersed in fantasy (Tolkien was the king) and never showed interest in books like the Logan series. My daughter, on the other hand, has never been interested in fantasy. Each to his own.
Alexandria, Va.:
I enjoyed The Land very much. It helped me understaned more about the times when there was slavery. Why do you suppose Miss Taylor wrote this book after writing the Trilogy?
Elizabeth Ward: According to Taylor, she first started writing fiction because one family story in particular kept nagging at her: the incident when some much-loved very old trees were cut down on her family's land in Mississippi. She struggled to find a voice for that story and came up with 8-year-old Cassie Logan. So she was willy-nilly starting her account of her family's extraordinary saga in the 20th century rather than the 19th. MAybe she didn't know how it would branch and grow. I suspect she simply felt the need at a certain point to go back and illuminate the roots before pushign on into the civil rights era and the present.
Catonsville, Md.:
(I haven't read it yet, but almost picked it up as a talking book yesterday) What social issues and/or values does The Land highlight for readers?
Also, my son and I have read Roll of Thunder and Circle a few years ago - I can't remember if [the "N" word] was used. I do remember the segregation (especially the bus/mud incident). Frankly, I'm not concerned about the use of the word, I'm wondering if it's a change in style or tone. I do realize that Cassie's tale is more oriented in her immediate family and neighbors, where her grandpa's tale sounds like it's set in the public adult society.
So, what are we in for?
Elizabeth Ward: Social issues or values? Taylor has put that as well as anybody. She has said something to the effect that in "The Land," like the books that follow it, she wanted to show black people as heroic. Especially in the context of a society designed to suppress and humiliate them. She does use the 'n' word in all her books and defends her use of it, I would say definitively, when she points out that the language is painful, but life was painful for the people who were addressed that way, and she intends to remember the pain on their behalf.
Alexandria, Va.:
I enjoyed reading The Land. I'm twelve years old,and would like to know what age group the Trilogy was writen for?
Elizabeth Ward: If you're 12 and you enjoyed "The Land" and have not yet read the trilogy, then you have a treat in store for you. Run, don't walk, to the nearest library and start reading! In general, though, I would say that "The Land" is pitched toward a slightly older age group than at least the first two books of the trilogy, if only because it takes Paul-Edward into full adulthood. I expect ti will be the same with "Logan," the working title for the sequel to "The Road to Memphis," which is due out in 2004, according to the publisher.
Millwaukee, Wis.:
I've read that Ms. Taylor's books are fiction, yet have a base in her family's heritage and include stories passed down from her grandparents.
I wonder does Ms. Taylor know what became of T.J., Jeremy or Jeremy's awful family? I also have wondered if Little Man grew up to be a wealthy clothing store manager? Looking good always was so important to him.
Her books touch my heart. I've never read them aloud to my children without finding myself in tears. It is good to share those moments and see my children feel those emotions. Thank you Ms. Taylor! Keep writing!
Elizabeth Ward: T.J. was executed for murder, wasn't he? At the end of "The Road to Memphis," Jeremy leaves and if I remember rightly Cassie remarks that they never see him again. But I can't help feeling the Simmses will make some appearance in the next book. Little Man, will, for sure.
Knoxville, Iowa:
I've not yet read The Land. But am looking forward to it.
I worked in an elementary school library for 10 years and each February I would read The Well, and my all time favorite Mississippi Bridge to the 4th grade classes. Both reveal the meaning of justice and equality without preaching.
I received my first Mildred D. Taylor book as a 15th birthday present. I've read and re-read each of her books to myself, my children, and students. She is a gifted storyteller who has helped 100's of Iowa school children understand life in the segregated southern United States. As well as breaking down racial stereotypes.
Just a note to thank her for continuing her work. Does she tour to promote her books? I'd make a trip to meet her.
Elizabeth Ward: Thanks. I don't believe Taylor travels much to promote her books, no. Rightly so, in my opinion. A good book promotes itself.
Lenexa, Kan.:
Enjoyed the description of your daughter with Taylor's Logan family series. Of the other favorites you mentioned, thanks to the Book Club (Asim), I had read Paul Curtis's two novels. I also picked up copies and am looking forward to reading "The Glory Field" and Paula Fox's "The Slave Dancer."
Our son is married and gone but I remember how much he loved Russell Hoban's "Emmet Otter's Jug-Band Christmas" (esp. the Jim Henson film with the gorgeous Paul Williams's melodies). Just wondering if that was also a favorite of your family? Also, I see where there was a 1978 film of "Roll of Thunder..." (couldn't locate in area VCR stores). Ever see it? Aware of any plans to film "The Land"? Thanks.
Elizabeth Ward: No, I don't know of any plans. It's probably too soon, as these things go, since the book has only been out a year or so. But I think it is very filmable. Don't know that particular Hoban, but we loved, and still love, others of his, especially "The Mouse and his Child."
Alexandria, Va.:
Why did Miss Taylor use bad language like "white nigger"?
Elizabeth Ward: I would say because she felt it would be untrue to her character's experience not to. It seems to me her use of that phrase, striking like the crack of a whip every time we hear it in "The Land," makes the best argument possible against anyone using it in everyday life now.
Somewhere, USA:
I am so glad that you wrote this article pointing out that there was a prequel and I cannot wait to read it! I loved this series as a child -- as did my parents when I was reading through it. I actually read this trilogy and Cynthia Voight's Dicey's Song at around the same time -- it was fascinating to read two such different but well-written tales focusing on similar concepts at the same time. It was thought-provoking and made me appreciate what I had not had to endure.
Elizabeth Ward: Thanks for your comments.
Alexandria, Va.:
Do you only review children's books?
Elizabeth Ward: Mostly children's books these days, since I write that twice-a-month column for Book World. But I review other books, mostly fiction, from time to time as well.
Lenexa, Kan.:
"Pride" can be tricky. Sometimes one can have pride in the wrong things. I remember John Hope Franklin's experience when he wrote his history of Negro Americans. People wrote him: "You forgot my forebear--the first man to haul ice in Savannah. Also my great uncle--the first man to stand on his head in a traveling circus." Franklin, a young black Harvard Ph.D., wrote back, "I didn't forget them. I just wasn't interested."
Re pride: Did you think it credible that Paul would turn down a loan from Luke Sawyer? (The plot, of course, allows it to work out nicely and does set up the touching death scene with his father.) Also, unlike Paul, perhaps Mitchell had more "swagger" than genuine pride. By comparison, Paul of course had the benefit of being so gifted with talent. Thoughts? Thanks.
Elizabeth Ward: Hello again, Kansas. Great anecdote. Yes, I found the scene where Paul turned down Luke Sawyer's offer of a loan credible, but wrenching, almost as wrenching in its way as the overtly more harrowing scenes between him and Filmore Granger. But don't forget Paul did allow himself to trust Charles Jamison, another white man, somewhat when he asked his help in drawing up the contract for his land.
Elizabeth Ward: Time's up, or even over, for today. Thanks for joining in, everybody.
washingtonpost.com:
That wraps up today's show. Thanks to everyone who joined the
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washingtonpost.com:
That wraps up today's show. Thanks to everyone who joined the
discussion.
Stay tuned to Live Online:
Got
Plans? at 1 p.m. EDT
The
Apartment Adviser at 2 p.m. EDT
Did you know that you can follow more than one Live Online discussion at
the same time? Just open another browser window and toggle back and
forth between discussions! And, if you miss one, catch up with the Live
Online transcripts.
Keep up with the latest in news, sports, politics and entertainment with
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