Jabari Asim

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Bookclub: "The Watsons Go to Birmingham"
Presented by Jabari Asim
Children's Book Editor, Book World
Thursday, Dec. 20, 2000; Noon EST

Welcome to the online meeting of The Washington Post Book Club, a monthly program presented by the editors and writers of Washington Post Book World. Book World Editor Jabari Asim will be leading the discussion on this month's selection, Christopher Paul Curtis's "The Watsons Go to Birmingham."

Jabari Asim is the children's book editor of The Washington Post's Book World and author of a new novel for young readers. Asim says he grew up reading "widely and unpredictably" across genres: he loved Dr. Seuss, The Call of the Wild, Nancy Drew mysteries inherited from an older sister, and stacks of comic books, especially the "super-hero-in-tights" variety.

He also wrote The Road to Freedom, a new novel for young readers about a 10-year-old boy named Ezra set in the post-Civil War South. Ezra and his father, both former slaves, seek to establish themselves after emancipation as they search for Ezra's mother, who disappeared when he was a baby.

The transcript follows.

Editor's Note: Washingtonpost.com moderators retain editorial control over Live Online discussions and choose the most relevant questions for guests and hosts; guests and hosts can decline to answer questions.

Jabari Asim: Good afternoon and welcome to our Book Club discussion. As I'm sure you already know, our selection this time is a real change of pace for us. "The Watsons Go to Birmingham--1963" (hereafter referred to as "Watsons") was written for grade-schoolers, but I like to think it works well also for adults. I anticipate comments and questions from readers of both age groups, which should make for a lively chat. I guess we should get started . . .

Fairfax, Va.: No questions

It was a great BOOK!

Jabari Asim: Now that's the kind of comment I like, and I heartily concur.

Arlington, Va.: My daughter (13-year-old) has a question -- she was confused about what happened at the church -- did he go inside or did he just imagine going inside, or did he run away? She would be asking the question herself, but when she tried to follow the instructions on how to get to this site from the hard copy of Book World, she couldn't find it and gave up and now she's doing her homework.

washingtonpost.com: To read upcoming reviews of Book Club selections, go to the Washington Post Book Club section.
You can find upcoming discussions and past transcripts on Live Online's: Book Club Live Transcript Page.

Jabari Asim: Good question. I thought Kenny actually went inside. I didn't think he'd had enough experience with those kinds of events to imagine the aftermath so realistically. I also think he had to go inside to recover the shoe from the rubble. This is all conjecture, of course.

Lenexa, Kans.: Mr. Asim,

Nice to be steered to Curtis. Read (enjoyed) both. Liked the intellectual construct of TWGTB--placing a kind, good-humored family in the evocative context of the '60s to culminate with the Birmingham bomb milestone. Love car trips-my own favorite memories. I especially enjoyed the maturation of Byron....

Your questions raise interesting points: Kenny and Joey's apparitions seem to complement each in saving the other. Kenny's hearing loss seems to capture the way a real-time tragedy unfolds. Does our belief in magic transcend our childhood? Like Byron, I tend to think not: "Wool Poohs" clarify as "Whirl Pools."

COMMENTS/QUESTIONS: Do you know the author? Do you expect he'll continue in the middle school-age niche? Thanks.

Jabari Asim: Thanks for your comments. I too appreciated the construct. At first it's hard to envision this good-humored family within the context of the 60s, which is so often portrayed as a turbulent time (and it was, in so many respects). And Curtis waits so long before making us aware of the violent backdrop unfolding in Birmingham. By then we've become so fond of these characters that it makes the bombing that much more devastating. I agree that Kenny's hearing loss effectively presents the way such things often happen, a subdued, surreal, slow-motion sort of aura often surrounds horrific events. I do think Curtis is trying to make a point about youthful innocence and faith in magic. Byron is already cynical and able to manipulate his younger siblings' still-ripe gullibility, while their parents, so long removed from magical considerations, often seem puzzled by Kenny's reaction to the trip.

Jabari Asim: I should add that I met Curtis at the National Book Festival last summer and found him to be very personable. He was sort of like a rock star in that he could hardly walk anywhere without being besieged for autographs, but he seemed unaffected by his fame. He read from a forthcoming manuscript that is aimed at the middle-school audience. It was a story about a boy with a stern mother who operated a string of convalescent homes. Unsurprisingly, it's set in Flint, Michigan.

Waldorf, Md.: When Kenny went to the church, why did he find Joetta's shoe with the picture of the white boy on the bottom of her shoe if she wasn't there, and if she had both of them when he got back home?

Jabari Asim: Buster Brown shoes were very popular back then, so quite likely one of the bombing victims was wearing a similar pair. Boys wore Buster Browns also; I had many pairs growing up. I still remember the theme song (I think):
I'm Buster Brown. I live in a shoe.
My dog's name is Tie. He lives there too.

Charlottesville, Va.: If you were Byron's mother, would you give such a severe punishment to your own child?

Jabari Asim: I wouldn't have been so severe, but I think Byron's mother response was realistic considering the time and place. For instance, corporal punishment (spanking) was not only accepted but often advocated, for better or worse. The incident made me recall an incident from my own childhood, when a kid across the street was playing with matches and set his sister's mattress on fire. In comparison to the punishment he received, Byron got off easy.

Charlottesville, Va.: I am 12 years old, and I have never heard of people threatening to burn their children.

Jabari Asim: Of course, Byron's mom would never have burned him for real. She just wanted to teach him a lesson, and back then, such parenting methods were not that unusual. At least in the neighborhood I grew up in. And Curtis and I are members of the same generation.

Charlottesville, Va.: Why do you think that Joetta tried to keep her mother from burning Byron's fingers, as his punishment for starting fires in the bathroom, even though he put her life in danger?

Jabari Asim: Hard as it to believe, some kid sisters are actually quite sweet. I think Curtis takes care to portray Joey as essentially sweet so that we'll have a greater appreciation of her brush with mortal danger later in the story.

Charlottesvile, Va.: What do you think is the funneist part of the book?

Jabari Asim: That's a tough one. Byron's getting stuck to the frozen mirror was pretty hilarious, although some readers may have some other nominations.

Waldorf, Md.: If the book is written by Christopher Paul Curtis, then why is the narrator "Kenny Watson?" This is non-fictional book ... what is the author's real name?

Jabari Asim: It's actually fiction, although the author did use some experiences from his own childhood.

Washington D.C.: Who are the people on the front cover?

Jabari Asim: I'm not sure where I encountered this information, but I heard or read somewhere that the author's real family members are pictured on the cover. The cute girl in the pigtails, for instance, is Curtis's sister.

Washington, D.C.: Mr. Asim,
I was struck by the tone of this book: gentle, more than angry. When I saw that it was meant for a middle-school audience, I thought it might be too dark a story for a young person, but Curtis is so subtle in the telling. Do you think a child will have a requisite sense of outrage about the bombing incident?

Jabari Asim: Good comments. I'm not sure that a child will necessarily be outraged by the bombing, and I'm not sure that such a reaction would suit the author's intentions. Kenny, for example, after his initial shock, seems more saddened than outraged. Shook from the gentle, loving cocoon in which his parents had carefully reared him, he seems to have received a glimpse of the corrupt side of human nature. He knows now that people can be cruel beyond reason, and this knowledge steals part of his innocence from him.

Lenexa, Kans.: Thanks for nice response. Even though both are works of fiction, they obviously owe much to family history. I enjoyed the pictures of Kenny, Byron, Joey, and the parents that were on the over of the paperback edition. Also, in Bud, Not Buddy, Curtis has pictures of his two grandfathers who inspired key characters. One is a handsome Michigan band leader and the other a baseball pitcher good enough to have paired off against Satchel Paige twice. Personally I've always liked the autobiographical fiction genre. Your thoughts? Thanks again

Jabari Asim: I'm also fond of this genre. Interestingly, I read Bud Not Buddy before reading "Watsons," which was one of those books I kept setting aside with plans to get to it someday. Bud, Not Buddy blew me away, however, so I couldn't wait any longer to read Watsons and of course was similarly impressed. I especially like Curtis's rendering of older adults in both books. The grandmother and the grandfathers (in Bud)remind me of people I knew and loved while growing up.

Charlottetsvlille, Va.: Do you have kids and do you treat them like that?

Jabari Asim: I have kids--four boys and one girl--and I tend to be a softie. I can't imagine raising a hand to them; I rarely even raise my voice, although I can be plenty irritating. One reason is because I love them so much and the other is I'm one of those grown-ups who actually prefers children to adults. I always wanted seven kids but my wife said five's the limit. Alas. . .

Charlottesville, Va.: Do you think that Byron is mean or nice and why?

Jabari Asim: I think Byron is both. Becoming a teenager hasn't been easy for him and is difficult for many folks, and I think this affects his behavior quite a bit. He's mean to Kenny in part because he wants to feel that he no longer has much in common with Kenny, that he's closer to manhood than boyhood. On the other hand, he's capable of great kindness and selflessness when the situation calls for it. Remember how he reacted to Kenny's near-drowning at the Landing and to Kenny's stay in the World Famous Watson Pet Hospital.

Fairfax, Va.: I think it was a good idea to put people on the cover so you could picture what they look like in your mind.

Jabari Asim: Good point. Many times I don't like pictures of the characters on the cover because I want to imagine them for myself. However, while reading the part about the church bombing, I found myself returning to the picture of the little girl on the cover.

Charlottesville, Va.: Does the bombing on Sept. 11 relate you to the the bombing in the book?

Jabari Asim: Absolutely. The Sept. 11 bombing left many of us with a greater appreciation of the reality of terror, that some crazy person or persons could strike out and hurt us without warning. The Southern folks in "Watsons" had to live with that kind of terror all the time. Curtis doesn't discuss it in the book, but the fact is bombings occurred fairly often in that part of the country during that time. The residents of Birmingham nicknamed their town "Bombingham" because there had been more than 50 bombings of black homes and churches within a ten-year period, and no one had ever been charged or arrested.

Flint, Mich.: What type of car is the "Brown Bomber?"

Jabari Asim: It was a 1948 Plymouth, "dull brown and real big." Such cars were popular with families with lots of children--in the era before mini-vans. My own family had a 1955 Plymouth during the sixties.

Lanier M.S.: I thought Wool Pooh was just Byron's version of whirlpool ... but then why did Kenny see the Wool Pooh every time he or a family member nearly encountered death? ... Was this his vision or picture of how death should be represented?

Jabari Asim: I'm not sure, but that's what I thought as well. When Kenny was in the water I thought he could have been hallucinating. In his hysteria, and later at the church, Byron's Wool Pooh rose in Kenny's imagination and helped him to get a handle on something as huge and unfathomable as death. Just a theory. . .

Silver Spring, Md.: I just knew that after Kenny saw his sister as an angel in the water that she would be killed in the church. Wouldn't the tragedy be more intense? Or would it be too much for that age group?

Jabari Asim: I don't know if it would have been too much, as the trend in such books has been to make them harder-edged. I think Curtis was in love with Joey and knew that readers would be too and thus wouldn't want her to die. I think he also wanted to honor the memory of the girls who did die by telling their story peripherally. Having Joey die would have required changing history and encroaching on the girls' life stories. My sense is he wanted to avoid diminishing the tragic fact of their loss.

Fairfax, Va.: One of my favorite parts of the book was when Byron was giving the "How to survive a snow storm" test on Kenny. I think that every brother should do stuff like that to younger siblings. Instead of it being mean, in a funny kind of way, it shows you care ... knowing this because I am a younger sister and all.

Jabari Asim: Well, you're a very understanding younger sister, I must say. I recall undergoing a similar test with my older brother, which concluded with a mouthful of sunflower seed shells being spat in my face at close range. Whenever I complained about such things to my mom, she'd tell me that my brother was just trying to toughen me up, get me ready for the real world. She'd agree with your comments about showing that you care.

Charlottesville, Va.: How old was the author when he wrote the book?

Jabari Asim: I'm guessing that the author was in his mid to late 30s when he wrote the book. I believe he started it while working on the assembly line at an auto factory in Flint. He said he used to write during his breaks and his lunch hour. Finally his wife suggested that he take a year off to see if he could finish his manuscript. She agreed to work as much as possible while he did this. Her plan worked out very well, because "Watsons" is the result.

McLean, Va.: I just wish to say, as a former elementary school teacher, that I would have been delighted to share/read "The Watsons Go to Birmingham" with my classes.
I have been reading The Post book club selections since April. I was wondering how the books were chosen? Did each presenter independently choose the selection they wished to review? What is the criteria?

Jabari Asim: I'm heartened to learn that you've been with us since April; I hope you continue to stick with us. It's entirely up to the presenter when it comes to selecting the books. There's no criteria, really. We just pick a book we like and would like to talk about. Sometimes it works out really well--as it did in this case, as I have received far more questions/comments than I could possibly respond to. It's been very gratifying, however, and I am very pleased that so many of you could join us today.

I'll close by inviting you all to join my colleague Chris Lehmann next month when he discusses "The Black Prince" by Iris Murdoch. He'll be online January 31 at noon.

Happy Holidays to all.

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