• theladybook.com • Talk: Style message boards • Live Online Transcripts • Subscribe to washingtonpost.com e-mail newsletters

Being a Lady
Hosted by Noelle Cleary and Dini Von Mueffling
Authors, "The Art and Power of Being a Lady"
Thursday, Oct. 11, 2001; 3 p.m. EDT

Authors Noelle Cleary and Dini Von Mueffling describe the word "lady" as having negative connotations in recent years -- conjuring up images of tea parties, white pearls and finger sandwiches. In "The Art and Power of Being a Lady, " the authors have updated the concept of being a "lady" for today's women, redefining the term to reflect independence, achievements and modern attitudes toward sex, relationships, work and parenting.

Cleary and Mueffling were online Thursday, Oct. 11 at 3 p.m. EDT to discuss the book and the definition of being a lady.

Cleary is the director of media convergence at the CRIME channel. Mueffling is a journalist who has written for major newspapers and magazines and produced for television news programs. She also co-founded the nonprofit AIDS education foundation Love Heals. Both live in New York.

The transcript follows.

Editor's Note: Washingtonpost.com moderators retain editorial control over Live Online discussions and choose the most relevant questions for guests and hosts; guests and hosts can decline to answer questions.

Lake Tahoe, Nev.: I read the book and was really impressed with the insight that the authors have.
I think men and woman can both learn a lot from this and the two women who wrote must be exceptional indeed.

Noelle Cleary and Dini Von Mueffling: Thank you. We try... :)

Washington, D.C.: Is a lady more likely to be Republican or Democrat?

Noelle Cleary and Dini Von Mueffling: A lady's political views have nothing to do with whether or not she's a lady...

Washington, D.C.: I always preferred the term "gentlewoman" to "lady." To me, "lady" always evokes the kind of woman who gets the vapors. A "gentlewoman," on the other hand, takes a riding crop to people who mistreat her servants.

Noelle Cleary and Dini Von Mueffling: While we understand the implication, the word "gentlewoman" is so outdated we believe"lady" is the appropriate term for what you descibe... i.e. the female equivalent of a "gentleman".

Forestville, Md.: Question:

How many stay-at-home moms were interviewed? Or any women who have their families as their first or second priorties? So far, I am pleasantly surprised by what I have heard and read about your book, and will pick it up soon.

Noelle Cleary and Dini Von Mueffling: Many stay-at-home Moms responded to our survey. However, we'd like to add that a lady puts her family first... always.

Paramus, N.J.: How do modern ladies deal with anger?

Noelle Cleary and Dini Von Mueffling: By taking a deep breath, counting to ten, and formulating a response (if necessary) that does not compromise her self-possession. (In other words, she doesn't blow her stack unles absolutely necessary.) :)

Sarasota, Fla.: Regarding alcohol consumption and swearing, how much leeway does a lady have compared to a gentlemen in letting down their hair.

Noelle Cleary and Dini Von Mueffling: We believe the standards should be the same for men and women. Letting down your hair is one thing, getting sloppy and embarassing, is quite another. As far as cursing, as we explain in the book, a lady knows the time and the place (and we explain those in detail in the manners chapter).

Somewhere, Md.: I am a "lady" and have always been. I don't drink, don't dress or speak or otherwise conduct myself in a vulgar manner, and know when to agree to disagree.

While this has served me well in my career, in my experience, it has not served me well in my love live. Men seem to much prefer the non-ladies out there. That is, the drunk, loud, trashily-dressed and/or agressive woman always seems to get her man. Are there guys out there who would choose to be with a woman who is a lady? Sometimes I wonder.

Noelle Cleary and Dini Von Mueffling: Sounds like you haven't met the right men...

Rockville, Md.: I find it hard to balance being a modern woman, a sorority sister, and a girlfriend. I am supposed to be an assertive woman with manners and a delicate nature who is submissive in the bedroom but knows what she wants and has no problem expressing it in any situation! Finding this balance is hard simply because I never know which "personality" I am supposed to unleash when! I find the challenge rewarding sometimes, because I get to learn so much about my wants and needs. But I also get mixed messages depending on the person with whom I am interacting! What do we do when this act becomes unbalanced and a chore?

Noelle Cleary and Dini Von Mueffling: It's not about unleashing a personality, it's about being yourself. (And, for the record, we don't say that a lady has to be submissive in the bedroom). She only has to be true to herself, honest... and have good intentions.

Mt. Rainer, Md.: I am relatively recently out of school and am an accountant for a CPA firm. I think that part of professionalism includes dressing like a professional, although my office is business casual. There seem to be no standards on what is appropriate. Retail stores/designers seem to think that I want to dress like characters on Ally McBeal -- very trendy -- and I can't find clothes that I think are classically elegant and professional. Do I have an out of date idea about what is appropriate? Can I go to work and meet clients in sheer blouses, showing cleavage and still be viewed with respect?

Noelle Cleary and Dini Von Mueffling: We agree with you. You don't need to dress like Ally McBeal. Business casual is not about dressing for a night club. You're right on. Those who wear borderline lingerie to an office might reconsider... You are not out-of-date.

Dupont Circle: Can a lady still scream at sporting events or even just watching the Redskins on TV?

Noelle Cleary and Dini Von Mueffling: You bet! Go ahead and paint you face, while you're at it! It all depends on what you scream, of course... :)

Washington, D.C.: Our fair city thanks you for including the grande dame of The Washington Post as a lady, however... you so spelled her name wrong. It is "Katharine" Graham. No "E." Ladies should admit when they're wrong.

Noelle Cleary and Dini Von Mueffling: Mea Culpa. And what a great lady she was... We'll tell our copy editors for the next printing. Thank you.

Washington, D.C.: Do you address the issue of class? "Von" for instance indicates aritocratic heritage, the traditional domain of "ladies."

Noelle Cleary and Dini Von Mueffling: Yes we do address class. Being a lady is a character issue, not a class issue. There are plenty of aristocrats whom we would not necessarily c onsider ladies...

Weehawken, N.J.: How does a lady feel about men who cry in movies?
Should she bring the tissues?

Noelle Cleary and Dini Von Mueffling: We love men who cry in the movies. We wish more did!!! There'd probably be less war... :)

Arlington, Va.: How do you feel about the book "The Rules?"

Noelle Cleary and Dini Von Mueffling: Doesn't work for us because its ultimate message was that in order to land a man a woman has to manipulate him in ways that seem... well... unladylike. (See our Romance chapter for more on that...)

Silver Spring, Md.: I have always considered myself a lady and never needed to have someone else define it for me. I am sure your book is interesting and makes a good conversation piece, but women have to be true to themselves. Knowing who you are is the key to becoming comfortable within your own skin. Trying to fit into some model or template defined by some well intentioned but looking for attention and trying to get paid writer is akin to taking seriously those Cosmopolitian Magazine test such as "What kind of Lover are You?"

Noelle Cleary and Dini Von Mueffling: We couldn't agree more. In fact, the main thesis of the book is that being lady is about being true to yourself.

Re: Ladies and Class: So in London, Lady Victoria Hervey isn't a lady?

Noelle Cleary and Dini Von Mueffling: Sorry, we don't know who she is.

Arlington, Va.: Who do you think is the ultimate lady?

Noelle Cleary and Dini Von Mueffling: There are many, but Oprah Winfrey ranks extremely high on our list, as do Audrey Hepburn and Rosa Parks.

Falls Church, Va.: Considering the spotlight currently on the plight of women at the hands of the Taliban in Afghanistan, don't you think your book is enforcing negative stereotypes that women are in some way a separate class of citizens?

Noelle Cleary and Dini Von Mueffling: Not at all. On the contrary.

Somewhere, Md.: what about the expression "A lady in public, a tart in private?"

Noelle Cleary and Dini Von Mueffling: Works for us!!!!

washingtonpost.com: Dini and Noelle, what made you decide to write this book?

Noelle Cleary and Dini Von Mueffling: We decided to write the book to address the outdated connotations of the word "lady." We were looking for a word to describe the kind of women we admired-- women with grace, dignity, a sense of humor, a sense of social responsibility, compassion-- all timeless qualities.

Re: ladies and class: Substitute the Hilton sisters for Hervey and you'll get the jist.....

Noelle Cleary and Dini Von Mueffling: Rather than point out those who haven't quite made the grade yet, we've chosen to shine our spotlight on those who have. You can draw your own conclusions from that answer. :)

Miss Edie in DC: Hello Ladies;
I'm a rather hefty woman who (to others dismay) likes to wear stripes (as well as halter tops). I've beeen told they don't flatter me. How might I respond to those who comment on my attire without sounding unladylike?

Noelle Cleary and Dini Von Mueffling: We believe that a lady "kills them with kindness." In other words, don't dignify other people's rudeness... ever.

Alexandria, Va.: I have to admit that my hackles went up when I saw the title of your book. (My car bears a bumper sticker that reads "Well-behaved women rarely make history," which indicates my feelings on the matter.) But your premise does sound interesting.

How does one be a lady without being a submissive boob without a voice of her own? After all, ladylike behavior didn't break down the walls in the workplace that allow me to work in a male-dominated field. And when is it appropriate to not be a lady? It's a delicate balance.

Oh, and to the previous writer, being submissive in the bedroom is the wrong approach: Research shows that a woman must know her own needs and work to achieve them in order to orgasm.

Noelle Cleary and Dini Von Mueffling: With regards to history, we beg to differ that those women that instituted change for the better all weren't ladies: cases in point-- Eleanor Roosevelt, Rosa Parks, Gloria Steinem, Toni Morrison, Billie Jean King... the list goes on.

Arlington, Va.: Can a girl with a pierced nose be a lady?

Noelle Cleary and Dini Von Mueffling: Of course!

Monte Carlo: How does a lady feel about men who never let them pay for anything? Should she just accept this outdated chivlary or make an issue of it?

Noelle Cleary and Dini Von Mueffling: Accept the chivalry, Matt.

Pittsboro, N.C.: Could you please name some of the things that are decidedly unladylike, but are common in today's woman?

Noelle Cleary and Dini Von Mueffling: Some of the basics like not saying "please" "thank you" or "excuse me" come to mind, for starters. Not holding the door for someone else... Interrupting...

Washington, D.C.: Who do you think made the best first lady?

Noelle Cleary and Dini Von Mueffling: There have been many great first ladies. We're partial to Eleanor Roosevelt, for what she accomplished and her unrelenting courage, and Jacqueline Kennedy for rising to the occassion time and time again and showing us the White House was not just a place for politicians, but for writers, artists, musicians and the like.

Alexandria, Va.: Can a lady smoke? Cigarettes, that is.

Noelle Cleary and Dini Von Mueffling: Of course. Although we don't recommend it for health reasons. However, we do expound on smoking etiquette in the book, such as not smoking around children.

Miss Edie in DC, again: I must agree with your answer to Monte Carlo about letting the man tip. My beau, Mr Jimmy, never lets me spend a dime. Incidentally, he Likes my outfits. He treats me like a Queen!

Noelle Cleary and Dini Von Mueffling: Good for you!

Self-defense: How does a lady defend herself against unwanted attentions, such as whistling or catcalling? What if the attentions become physical, such as at a dance club where fellows get grabby?

Noelle Cleary and Dini Von Mueffling: Ignore the rude catcalling. Never let them know they affected you or even broke your stride.
As far as grabby men on dancefloors, get out of their reach and/or look them in the eye and ask them to stop...

Washington, D.C.: What word would you use to characterize yourself, if not "lady?"

Noelle Cleary and Dini Von Mueffling: Noelle: For me "goofball"
Dini: ... "workaholic Mom"

Washington, D.C.: Can we agree that it is ladylike to at least offer to pay, or if that offer is declined to reciprocate the man's generosity in some way? I think women who always find themselves in the restroom when the check arrives are decidedly UN-ladylike.

Noelle Cleary and Dini Von Mueffling: We agree. In fact we convey that sentiment almost verbatim in the Romance chapter of the book. You read our minds!

Silver Spring, Md.: Just curious, but would you consider the likes of Madonna or Courtney Love to be "ladies?" Thanks.

Noelle Cleary and Dini Von Mueffling: To us one of the hallmarks of a being lady is an aware of how your actions and word affect others. If you feel this applies to Madonna and Courtney, so be it.

Noelle Cleary and Dini Von Mueffling: Thank you everyone for your inciteful questions. It has been a pleasure chatting with you all.

   |      |