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Fast Food Nation
With Author Eric Schlosser
Tuesday, Feb. 6, 2001; 2 p.m. EST

Can a Chalupa widen the gap between rich and poor? Have Big Macs propelled American imperialism and the spread of obesity? Why are french fries so good?

Eric Schlosser

Eric Schlosser will be online to take your questions and comments on the fast food industry and his new book.

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Eric Schlosser: hello, Eric Schlosser here...

glad to answer your questions (if I can)--

Arlington, Va.: Exactly how many McDonalds are there in the U.S.? What about globally?

Eric Schlosser: Well, first off...

today there are about 28,000 McDonald's worldwide...

about half of them in the United States.

In 1968, there were just a thousand McDonald's; nowadays about two thousand new McDonald's open every year.

Somewhere, USA: Two questions:

How have fast food franchises, such as McDonalds and KFC, affected American globalism?

Does your book only look at the negative effects of such an industry or can you name some positives?

Eric Schlosser: The fast food chains are always in the avant-garde of globalization (also known as Americanization or McDonaldization). It's remarkable how quickly fast food restaurants appear in newly opened markets; other franchised businesses soon follow. In the book, I write about a little town in East Germany, where the McDonald's was the first new business to open after the fall of the Berlin Wall.

I tried to give a balanced and complex portrait of the fast food industry. It was not my intention to demonize anyone or tell the story in black-and-white, with simple heroes and villains. I met a lot of well-intentioned, good people in the industry. Many of the individual franchisees are terrific--hard-working, small businessmen who in many ways represent the best of the American dream. The industry employs millions of people, often giving them their first jobs. Fast food is inexpensive and convenient and it tastes really good. In that little East German town, the McDonald's was the cleanest, brightest place to eat--by far.

So there are many positive things about fast food in the book. But I also examine some of the consequences you rarely hear about--consequences that don't appear in the happy, cheery fast food ads. As I say in the book, the real cost of fast food does not appear on the menu

New Orleans, La.: What is the most shocking thing you learned about the fast food industry while researching for the book?

Eric Schlosser: The most shocking thing was what's going on in modern slaughterhouses and hamburger grinders, the huge factories now producing beef for the fast food chains.

I was appalled by how the workers are being treated, the dangers of the job.

And I was appalled by some of the stuff that's being ground up into the meat.

Bethesda, Md.: Do you feel some of your observations about the fast food industry carry over to other types of chain restaraunts? (i.e Friday's).

If so which ones and why do you think that is?

Eric Schlosser: I didn't look very closely at the "casual dining" chains.

They obviously have emulated the fast food chains, in the way they spread identical stores to multipe locations.

I think you're more likely, at those places, to get food that's actually been prepared in the kitchen. And the wages are somewhat higher.

My main focus, in the book, is on the fast food chains.

Md.: Are you going to be specific or do we have to buy your book. What was ground in the meat?

I thought that the most dangerous job (often with illegal immigrants working at) was a chicken factory.

Eric Schlosser: The most dangerous job in the United States, with the highest injury rate, is working in a beef slaughterhouse.

The poultry plants are bad, too--but not as bad.

I'll be a bit more specific (though I can't really do it justice here):

Twenty-five years ago, when you bought a burger, it was probably made at a small processing plant or at a butcher's. There was likely to be pieces of one cow or one steer in your hamburger. Today ground beef is made at enormous processing plants that can produce almost a million pounds of hamburger meat a day, by grinding together lots and lots of cattle, often from different countries. One sick cow can contaminate tons and tons of meat.

Your typical fast food hamburger today contains pieces of dozens, if not hundreds of different cattle.

That greatly increases the odds of pathogens spreading far and wide.

And where do the pathogens in your burger generally come from?

Cattle manure...

but you'll have to read about that in the book--

SOMEWHERE, USA: Are there any specific policies you'd like government to enact to curtail the industry's worst problems?

Eric Schlosser: The federal government should:

--crack down on the safety violations in America's meatpacking plants

--pass a new law that gives the government the power to recall contaminated, potentially deadly meat (right now all meat recalls are "voluntary").

--the government should have the power to fine meatpacking companies that knowingly ship tainted meat

--there should be an independent food safety agency, separate from the USDA, with broad powers to protect the public health

--imports of cattle should be banned immediately, to protect agains the entry of mad cow disease to the United States

---the feeding of cattle blood to cattle, and the feeding of dead cattle to poultry (both widespread practices today), should be banned for similar reasons

and more proposals than I can list here, such as tougher OSHA rules for fast food restaurants (the fast food industry just won an exemption, so that they don't have to even report monthly injuries to OSHA)...

Baltimore, Md.: Re: your comment about dangers and contamination in meat plants. My dad worked at a meat-packing plant in Baltimore after WWII and into the 1950's, way before fast food places took root. He would never eat hot dogs or lunch meat because he saw them being made! He saw one co-worker's finger get sliced off in a meat slicer. He also hated the Kosher days when rabbis would slit the throats of cattle without them being stunned first.

It was a rough, dangerous job for all involved, and he was not an immigrant -- born and raised in the US of A just trying to keep a roof over our heads.

Eric Schlosser: It's always been a tough, unpleasant, dangerous job.

But as recently as the late 1970s, it was also a well-paid job. Now it's one of the lowest-paid manufacturing jobs in the United States.

As for what's in the meat, there's no excuse, in the year 2001, for some of the food safety lapses, and for the federal government's inability to crack down on these companies.

Sonoma, Calif.: What kind of oil is used for frying french fries? If it is a blend of different kinds of fat, what is the major component?

Eric Schlosser: hydrogenated vegetable oils...

mainly cottonseed, I believe...

very high in trans-fatty acids.

Arlington, Va.: Perhaps it's my imagination but. . . I find that, after eating a big mac or drinking a coke one day, I crave one the next day much more than normal.

Did you find any evidence that fast food companies add addictive ingredients to their products? If it worked for the tobacco industry, surely it has at least crossed their mind.

Eric Schlosser: The "addictive" ingredients added are:

fat, salt, and sugar...

three things that humans instinctively crave.

Arlington, Va.: Are you crazy saying nasty things about the beef industry after they went after Oprah? Watch your back and have someone else taste your burger, buddy.

Eric Schlosser: thanks for the concern...

despite all I've seen, I still eat beef (though not ground beef)...

I think it's in the meatpacking industry's own interest, long-term, to change some of its business practices...

hopefully, they'll listen to some of their critics before suing them--

Columbia, Md.: In your experience, do the managers really care about their staff. The local chains have been sending home flyers they have passed out at high schools touting the "benefits of responsibility, learning to organize time, flexible hours sensitive to the student worker". My feeling is this is so much hog swill.

Eric Schlosser: Individual managers do care about their teenage workers, make sure they get their homework done, teach them good work habits, etc...

but many managers don't.

And the fast food industry, as a whole, has worked hard to provide as little training as possible to their workers.

WDC: Hi,

Interesting subject matter. I was wondering- do you eat fast food?

Eric Schlosser: Used to be that a cheeseburger and fries was my favorite meal...

but I don't eat burgers anymore.

I still eat a lot of fries...

and I buy them from places that seem to be doing business the right way--

smaller chains like Conways Red Top and In-N-Out burger

Arlington, Va.: Does your book discuss how McDonaldization in fast food (and in general) affects the environment? (e.g., packaging waste, animal and farming considerations, human health even) I know McDonald's shaped up a few years ago, but I'm wondering if they and others are still at it?

Eric Schlosser: McDonald's shaped up, sort of, in the United States (though it generates a lot of unneccessary paper waste)...

but in other countries McDonald's still uses plastic containers...

and the book does examine, at length, the effects of the highly industrialized agriculture that now supplies the major chains.

Arlington, Va.: Are there different laws about meat quality for overseas Fast Food chains?

Eric Schlosser: Food safety laws in Denmark, Sweden, and the Netherlands, among others...

are much tougher than in the United States...

and are much tougher on the slaughterhouse and feedlot operators that supply the fast food chains overseas.

SS, Md.: Will McDonalds ever go away? Will people ever learn? It sickens me to walk past McDs on the way to the metro and see all the kids eating their dinners there. I saw one kid in the window who looked about 2 eating a sandwich of some kind. That can't be good for anyone, let alone a child.

Eric Schlosser: McDonald's may in fact go away, some day...

twenty years ago, nobody would have thought that Montgomery Ward would shut down, or that Sears would be closing stores throughout the country...

if McDOnald's doesn't do a better job of adapting, it may be in trouble...

its profits are down...

its restaurants in Europe and Asia are not doing well...

and in the United States the market for fast food may be saturated...

so I think right now the big chains will be more responsive to consumer demands than ever before

D.C.: Your book sounds like an enlightening expose of the Fast Food Industry - heard an interview w/you on Public Radio. Since fast food appears to be here to stay, what specific changes do you believe health advocates should push the industry to make, in order to make the food healthier and the production process more humane? Of coure, I will continue to refrain from eating fast food and enourage others to do the same, but in the meantime, a whole lot of the junk is being wolfed down... seems like there should be ways to make it it less health threatening.

Eric Schlosser: If an adult wants to walk into a fast food restaurant and order a triple-cheeseburger with bacon and some supersize fries, well...

it's a free country, they should go right ahead.

but the major chains should not be allowed to advertise unhealthy food to children.

the obesity rate among American children has doubled since the late 1970s, along with the rise in fast food consumption.

and I think enormous pressure should be placed on the fast food industry to change the contents of their kid's meals, encourage them to sell healthy happy meals...

we don't allow liquor or cigarette ads to be aimed at children...

and obesity is now the nation's second leading cause of death (after tobacco)

Bethesda, Md.: Found the chapter on natural and artificial flavoring a little frightening. What were the most suprising food items you found containing them?

Eric Schlosser: most surprising:

all the organic "health" foods that have their flavor additives manufactured at the same specialty chemical plants that make flavor for the big fast food chains...

and the big pet food companies.

nothing necessarily "dangerous" about it...

just a symptom of how industrialized our food supply has recently become

D.C.: So, is Subway the healthiest fast food place?

Eric Schlosser: Subway has made the most concerted, most sincere effort...

to promote healthy food..

McLean: Occasionally one may have to drive through McDonald's just to stave off hunger -- perhaps not the first choice, but the one that lies in the path between work and taking your kid to baseball practice on a tight schedule. Where can one get nutritional information -- real numbers -- on various fast food options? Short of going up to the manager of each chain and asking for hard copy (I'm thinking of on-line information).

Eric Schlosser: all of the major chains...

put nutritional information on their web sites

Annapolis, Md.: Thanks for taking my question. I guess that my biggest hesitation about fast food is the age of the workers. I can't believe that a 16, 17 year old really has respect for sanitation. Is that a valid concern?

thanks.

Eric Schlosser: some do...

some don't...

and the most important determinant is the manager on duty: does he or she treat the kids well? does he or she run a tight ship?

D.C.: Thanks for being here Eric.

So spill the refried beans: How disgustingly fat-laden IS most fast food?

Eric Schlosser: most of it is extremely high in fat...

there's one burger at Burger King that has 65 grams of fat...

that a lot of fat for a sandwich, and that's not including the fries...

Laurel: Why are all Wendy's next to a McDonalds?

Does the Wendy's chain just wait for McD's to open and then grab a nearby site? Do they use the same business-locator service?

Eric Schlosser: McDonald's is the real expert at site selection...

and so wherever a McDonald's opens, other fast food chains soon appear, figuring it must be a great place to do business

Reston, 20190: First: I worked at McDs in 84, before I joined the Army, and was impressed with how clean the place was kept. Always wiping up spills, etc. We were very uptight about cleanliness. Second: As a computer programmer who's worked in industrial automation I'm aware of how amenable fast food would be to automation. I can see a time, not far off, where there won't be people working at McDs, Burger King, etc, except for the guy who reloads the cooking machines. Any job that requires doing the same thing repeatedly, without thought, can be automated. And will be.

Eric Schlosser: The chains are doing everything in their power to automate everything in the kitchen...

and since the food is so highly processed...

and essentially manufactured elsewhere...

there's still a lot of room for further automation of the cooking (and re-heating) that takes place behind the counter--

Eric Schlosser: I've got to run now...

thanks for all the questions...

sorry I didn't have time to answer them all--

best

Eric Schlosser

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